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1441  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Re: Over-sink cutting board on: September 09, 2014, 09:46:43 am
I bought a large thick white plastic cutting board.  I really like your idea.  I think I will cut our board to drop into that space.  A fantastic idea you have there.   ThankYou  A "Mark Helpful" for you.

That is such a great idea, I think that something the factory should be including.
1442  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Re: Rust on interior of door frame on: September 09, 2014, 09:44:22 am
All of your posts prommpted me to check my 2012 2552 and found the same problem rust.  I figure it is a result of my trip down to Florida last winter.  One question I have , did anyone remove the electric step before applying chassis saver.  It would seem that there probably is rust under the step.  I also found rust on other things under motorhome and plan treat them as well.  How far doesa quart of this stuff go?
I was all ready to apply a couple coats of protection.  It had ben many years since I looked under there and assumed it was screaming for help.  But our step box is hardly rusted, more like virgin metal with a little more than discoloration.  But what really stopped me was that I would definitely remove that step mechanism to do it right.  I figured given our particular situation, it was not worth  doing yet.

Our rig has not seen salt as of yet and stored indoors, apparently why so little degradation.
1443  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: PC vs.Nexus on: September 08, 2014, 09:43:18 am
Extra storage is great only if you have the ability to safely carry the extra stuff otherwise you have very nice, but empty, bins.
 You are right about that.  Some manufactures offer huge storage but is weight-capable deficient.  I think those rigs are ideal for a young family so the parents can haul all the kids huge light-weight plastic riding & play toys to the camp ground.....very bulky but no weight.
1444  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: New PC owner Coaster on: September 08, 2014, 09:04:34 am
We just bought a 2013 PC 2350 frrom Earl in July. We are retired and live in Chicago and Englewood Florida for the winter. If you have found any groups or clubs we should join, let us know. Looking forward to using our PC.

Chet & Marsha
Yet another new PC owner.  It is great that so many new owners get connected on this form.  We learn so much from each other.  Welcome Chet & Marsha.
1445  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: September 08, 2014, 09:02:19 am
Hi,

We are the new owners of the 2013 custom gold painted 2400 PC shown on the PC website and on Tube.  Bought it in Ft. Pierce FL the beginning of Aug and took our first 2 week trip to Missouri to see friends last week.  We named it The Bear Den since our 10 yr old rescue male Bichon, Polar Bear, and our 12 yr old Sun Conure Parrot named Sun Bear, travel with us. This was our first RV and first time camping. The dog bed fits nicely behind the drivers seat and the bird cage between the chairs during the day and on the back counter by the ref at night.  A good time was had by all until the trip home.  A rock went through the windshield, kicked up by dump truck in AL.  Insurance company had it fixed by SafeLite promptly.  Then our slide got stuck and the cabinet side would not move.  Were able to manually push it in and out until we got home and call Kermit.  Will be working on fixing it this week. Anyone with tips or tricks please respond.  We stayed mostly at State Parks with full hook ups.  No reservations just stopped when we were tired.

We looked for 6 months and the 2400 was the only unit for us. We did not want to waste space on a separate bedroom, wanted the door at the back, kitchen, bathroom and comfortable seating were a must.  This unit gives us all that and more.  Everything we need fits and everyone is comfortable.  Love our new PC even with the glitches..javascript:void(0);
Steve and Paulette (and the Bears)
Another new PC owner.  Awesome!  Welcome.

Ron
1446  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: September 08, 2014, 09:01:06 am
Hello   I just picked up our 2919T on Tue. 8 26 2014. The people at the factory was very helpful. Spent the last 2 days cleaning outside and inside.
 Will load Monday for our first trip next week with the Grandkids on the week end.  We have had two 5 wheels pulled with GMC 3500 dis. This is my first Ford will see how it goes.
I have been on the discussion board about 12 weeks to see what problems I can expect with a new unit.  Thanks for all the tips.

    jas   Huntington WV
Hi jas,
Welcome to the Phoenix family!
1447  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Ron's Tips For Class C /B+ Shoppers on: September 07, 2014, 11:56:35 pm
I post this on occasion as a reply to people shopping for a class C on www.rv.net, and thought it would be of interest to people browsing this PC forum.  It morph'd into more of an article rather than a reply.  It is an objective opinion (or so I tried), not a sales pitch for a PC, though I use my own 2007 PC-2350 as a given "positive" example.  

Ron
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New, used, or well used, when shopping for a conventional class B+ or C, the most important consideration is how it is constructed.  This post outlines construction methods which are most affordable and methods that cost more, but are built to hold up much better to the elements and also the punishment of the road.

Some motor home manufactures offer different levels of quality through their various model lines. Instead of providing a list of brands to consider, it is best to identify what "Better" is.

When shopping for a motor home, don't get distracted with "Eye Candy" and "Square Footage". You want to pay close attention to how the house is constructed.  Water infiltration is the number one killer of motor homes, rotting them away long before anything is worn out. Once water gets inside, it is like termites.  By the time you realize there is a problem, a lot of damage has already occurred. Also consider that mold & mildew can grow inside the walls which then you have a health hazard. My advise focuses on identifying a reliably well sealed motor home.

#1 BEST (Very Expensive, Can Be 1.5 times the cost of Second Best)
NO structural seam work. The brand Coach House is a fine example. It is seamless, made from a mold. The only places where water can leak is cutouts for windows, entry door, roof-top vents & a/c unit, storage compartments & maintenance access, all of which are in areas of very low stress. Because they have a seamless shell, these motor homes have a limited selection of sizes.

#2 SECOND BEST
Common, Affordable, & comes in Many Sizes so this is my main focus
I own an example of this type.   My Rig Here manufactured by Phoenix USA.
Made in sections, but assembled in a way that greatly reduces the threat of water damage. Here are the good things you want to look for.

a) Structural Seams Away From Corners
When a motor home is driven, the house bounces, resonates, shakes, and leans countless times, representing a endless series of earthquakes. Corner seams see greater stresses than seams located elsewhere. Corner seams are more easily split, especially when the caulk gets brittle with age & exposure to the sun. One extremely bad bump in the road can instantly breach a corner seam. Seams hold up much better when they are brought in from the corners in lesser stressed areas.

b) A Seamless Over-The-Van Front Cap
A huge bed above the vans roof is the most vulnerable area of a motor home. No matter how well they are made, that long frontal over-hang resonates when the RV is driven making it common for seams to split there, most troublesome with age & exposure to the elements.  HERE is an example, one of many water-damage threads I have read.  Scroll down in that thread to see pictures of the real damage.

The small front aerodynamic cap of a B+ design HERE eliminates the overhang which eliminates most of the resonation, along with most seam work.

There are a few conventional C Designs (big over-van bed) where that area is seamless. If you absolutely must have that huge bed, then look for a seamless bucket-like design. Born Free offers a seamless bucket design as seen in  This Model.  The Itasca Navion Here is another fine example.  Some manufactures as of late offer a partial bucket design with fewer seams located in less-stressed areas.  Some manufacture models like the Minnie Winnie and the Nexus Phantom utilize a compromising partial bucket design, making it a better choice compared to a fully seamed cab-over bed.

If you plan to accommodate more than 2 people, having that large extra cab-over bed will be extremely useful.

c) A Crowned Roof
Rain and snow melt runs off a crowned roof. A flat roof will sag over time, then water puddles around heavy roof-top items like the a/c unit. Water eventually finds it's way inside after gaskets & caulk have degraded from age, sun, and change in seasons.

d) Rolled-Over-The-Edge seamless Fiberglass Roof Sheathing
A single sheet of fiberglass as shown HERE that rolls over the right & left sides of the roof, down to the wall. The overlapping of fiberglass to the wall provides a good water seal and the fiberglass sheathing holds up better than roofs made of sheet rubber or thin plastic called TPO, which require more attention to keep your RV well protected.

e) A Five Sided Rear Wall Cap
A five sided back wall moves the seams around to the sides to areas of much less stress as seen HERE.  The rear wall resembles a shallow rectangular cooking pan standing on it's side.  Like the example, some rear wall sections are constructed with an integrated spare tire compartment and rear storage compartment.  Not only are they convenience features, but that rear wall/cap offers a solid double-wall for exceptional strength which is more resistant to flexing the adjoining seam work.  It helps in keeping the house together.

Don't be fooled.  There are a select few manufactures who add rear wall sectional styling pieces over an entry level rear corner seam design which gives the appearance of a 5-sided pan design.  You can easily tell by noting the sections & seams between them and the flat back wall that remains exposed.

Bigger Will Be Weaker
The size & floor plan you select MUST FIRST meet your needs before this consideration.
The bigger the house, the weaker the structure will be.  Consider two cardboard boxes made from the exact same corrugated material.  The smaller box would naturally be stronger.  It will be more resistant to bending, twisting, and other types of flexing.  So if you are on the fence between models, the smaller one will be your stronger choice.

Potentially Troublesome Construction
Entry level motor homes are made with seams in corners and finished off with trim, including the massive cab-over bed.  Their roof is flat and finished with rubber or TPO. They are most affordable, and come in all sizes. HERE is one such example.  If considering this construction type, keep in-mind they require more regular care with bi-annual inspections. Plan to use a caulking gun now and then. When buying a used one, consider that you really don't know how well the previous owner maintained it. Buying new or used, that construction method will be counting on you to be a good non-neglectful owner.

There are also the rare exception of the Lazy Daze which has seam work in the corners, but the substructure and sealing method is of the highest quality that it holds up like a seamless body. It's excellent sectional construction methods are not commonly found in other brands. I am no expert on this, but I'd give it a #1.5 Almost Like Best

About The Chassis
The most popular is the Ford E350 and E450 with the V10 engine. The Sprinter diesel is a popular alternative to the E350 in the smaller sizes.  Also within this past year is the recent introduction of the Ford Transit. The GM 3500 & 4500 chassis are not popular but are a very good choice for the right application. Any of the chassis mentioned made since 1998 are real good, new or used. If you plan to tow a car or heavy trailer, be aware that the Sprinter & Transit will be least powered. People who tow with them naturally take it slower.

If considering a current-day small class B+ or C motor home, here is a comparison between the two current main chassis contenders, the Sprinter with the V6 diesel engine and the Ford E350 with the V10 gasoline engine.

Advantages Of The Mercedes Sprinter With Diesel Engine
- Offers a 35%-50% improvement in fuel economy over the Ford-V10, when both are loaded and driven identically.
- More ergonomic driver compartment with more leg room.
- Comfort continues with a car-like feel & quiet ride.
- A grander view out the windshield
- Made by Mercedes which people are attracted to.

Advantages Of The Ford E350 with V10 Engine
- Given identical motor homes both brand and model, the Ford is around $13,000 MSRP cheaper
- The Ford V10 engine has 50% more horse power and torque
- The Ford E350 chassis handles 1430 pounds more weight.
- The E350 is able to tow a heavier load.
- The E350 rear axle is significantly wider which translates to better stability.
- In most places traveled, gasoline costs less than diesel fuel
- The Sprinter diesel has limited mechanical service shops around North America
- The Sprinter diesel is typically outfitted with a propane generator.  Propane is a critical fuel for RV operations, and generally needs to be rationed when dry camping.
- This Next Point Is Debatable But Still Worth Noting....The V6 Sprinter diesel engine is not allowed to idle for extended periods. This limitation is detrimental when you need a/c but there are generator restrictions, you are low on propane, or you have a mechanical failure with the generator or roof a/c. The Ford offers a great backup system. The V10 can safely idle for hours on end, heating, cooling, and battery charging, all valuable if you have a baby, pets, or health/respiratory issues.

You decide what your priorities are, and pick the appropriate chassis. There are some really sweet motor homes being built exclusively on the Sprinter chassis, such as the Winnebago Navion & View. Others like Phoenix USA build their model 2350 and 2400 on both the Sprinter and Ford E350. They will even build it on the heaviest duty E450 upon request for a nominal fee. People who request an E450 for a small motor home, tow heavier things like for example, a multi-horse trailer.  You can even special order a E350 & E450 4x4.

There is so much cool stuff offered in recent years on the Sprinter and most recently on the new Ford Transit.

The Ford Transit Chassis
This chassis has the potential to dominate the class B+ & C motor home market in the smaller sizes.  According to Ford's website, the Transit DRW chassis is offered in the 156", and 178" wheel base, and is rated as high as 10,360 GVWR.  Ford offers a motor home package specific for the RV industry.  It's diesel engine compares to the Sprinter in power and fuel economy, but is more affordable and is easily serviced at Ford service centers, just like the E350 & E450.  The cab has a much lower stance than the Sprinter making it much more friendly to get into and out from for people in their later years.  It's more like a mini-van rather than a standard van.  The Transit's lower cab also offers roomier over-head bunks that are easier to access.

The Dodge Promaster 3500 Cut-Away Chassis
This front wheel drive chassis is another recent entry in the RV industry.  I am concerned over it's lack of load capability as reflected with single free-wheeling rear wheels.  I have been reading posts written by new Promaster RV owners stating they are over-weight with just two people, some personal effects and food.  They say they can't carry water and never a 3rd person.  I would not be comfortable with such a limited load range in a B+ or C.  This chassis does seem to be a good option in the "B" motor home market.

The Chevy 3500 & 4500 Chassis
Unfortunately this chassis is not more popular, primarily because GM sort-of gave up on competing with the Ford E350 & E450.  It offers more interior comfort than the Ford, but not as much as the Sprinter.  It's power & weight ratings are a little less than their Ford counter-parts making them a great chassis for all but the heaviest of class Cs.  They are also a little better on fuel consumption.  One thing to keep in-mind, if you are counting inches in storing your rig, the Chevy is a little longer than the Ford by a number of inches which was critical for us with our garage as seen HERE with our Ford 2007 E350 rig.  That could be the reason why the Chevy has a little more interior driver/passenger leg room.

Engine Power Ratings of Ford, MB-Sprinter, Chevy, and Dodge
Ford E350 & E450 - 6.8L-V10, 305hp, 420ft
Ford Transit Diesel - 3.2L-I5, 185hp, 350ft
Mercedes Sprinter Diesel - 3.0L-V6, 188hp, 325ft
Chevy 3500 & 4500 - 6.0L-V8, 323hp, 373ft
Dodge Promaster - 3.6L-V6 (GVW only 9,300 pounds)
1448  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: PC vs.Nexus on: September 07, 2014, 07:29:05 am
Since we are discussing quality, on rv.net I recall around 2008-2009 that Fleetwood had serious quality issues.  One story in particular, a new owner seeing sun light beaming inside one of his hanging kitchen cabinets.  The solution was of coarse caulk.  Soon thereafter the company got bought out, but I don't recall by whom.

Reading story after story of different sagas from a variety of motor home manufactures, I learned much about good versus poor construction.  My replies on quality got more and more detailed to the point that it looks more like an magazine article than a reply.

I should try copying that reply of mine into a new post here.
1449  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: PC vs.Nexus on: September 06, 2014, 01:32:50 pm
.....and that PC doesn't make over the cab bed class C models like Nexus does.
Someone somewhere mentioned someplace that Phoenix made a class c cab-over bed for a customer in Europe.  I heard it just once, never able to confirm it.  It did have me wondering if they are experimenting with larger fronts for cab-over beds.  That would make for a nice option on any model, especially nice for the 2100, 2400, and families.
1450  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: PC vs.Nexus on: September 06, 2014, 10:05:56 am
As I remember it, when Nexus first started, they hacked a PC owners list and solicited all of them to switch to Nexus.
I recall getting an email from Nexus, wondering how they knew about me.  It is possible they went on www.rv.net and plucked our email addresses from there.
1451  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: PC vs.Nexus on: September 06, 2014, 09:58:28 am
As bobojay and I have described, the Nexus is not a higher end rig.  It seems to be a little higher than the entry level and priced accordingly.  I would surely look at them if considering an entry level.  Paying a little more to get a little better could be worth it.  Because of them being a small factory direct operation like PC-USA, they offer the ability to make deviations the big companies cannot, another advantage to me.
1452  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: PC vs.Nexus on: September 05, 2014, 09:38:05 pm
On other forums, people who own a Nexus praise the company and their products.  Nexus is only a few years old so nobody knows how well their rigs will stand the test of time.  But I don't see anything alarming on my computer screen.  I can't say they are built as well as a Phoenix Cruiser, but the price is adjusted lower accordingly.  I personally have trouble with their rear wall construction method.  PCs have a solid 5-sided semi-double-wall rear wall.  The Nexus appears to use a flat panel with a top cap for style.  Motor homes in general count on the rear wall to keep the structure squared up so a PC should do a better job of it.  Also the Nexus rear wall places the seam work in the corners instead of around to the sides.  I feel the corners see a lot more stress so I would not want the seam work there.

Keep in-mind I never kicked the tires of a Nexus, so don't take my input too seriously.  It has been a long time since I walked through an RV show.
1453  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Re: Wax/Protection advice please on: September 05, 2014, 02:26:14 pm
I too have the full body paint.
I just wash the whole motorhome.
I don't bother using 303 or any other wax.
My unit looks like it is new. This is just what I do.
With full body paint you do not have any decals to go bad.
I waxed our 2007 full body paint at the end of the season for the first two years.  It's been a long time (maybe 5 years) since the last waxing and just like Tom, the rig looks great.  Keep in mind that our rig stays indoors when not on trips.  I am sure that makes a huge difference.

Our rig has all wording as decals, applied after the paint job.  PC-USA must have changed it some time thereafter.  Painted lettering is better for it will age at the same rate as the rest of the finish.
1454  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Reunion in Colorado on: September 05, 2014, 12:57:36 pm
There is a remote chance we'll be in the area in our PC, maybe close enough to stop in for a day or two, but my wife wants to see Maine, not Colorado.  We'll find out soon enough if the sun is in our faces or on our backs.  It sure would be nice to meet the gang.
1455  Main Forum / Photos / Re: Shade for the new PC on: September 03, 2014, 06:00:28 pm
You sure have a lot more time with temporary shelters than me.  I am glad you are confident with your heavy duty flavor.  Cross brace or not, your decision is based from lots of extreme weather experiences.  I feel better for your decision, knowing that now about you.

Blessings!
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