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1801  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Towing Dinghys on: February 17, 2012, 08:45:27 pm
Barry, With my Liberty weighing a "corrected" 4300 pounds  Cry before I add all the extras like tow bars, rear hitch, bikes and rack, golf clubs, etc, etc., I still would not exceed 5000 pounds.  But your comment is well noted.  If considering a heavier vehicle yet, then adding all that extra stuff, it could exceed the limit.
1802  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Electric sofa/bed question on: February 17, 2012, 08:38:32 pm
Hey DJM,  That is a very nice rig.  I have a question about it.  I noticed the rear outdoor storage under the bed is reconfigured differently than mine from 2007.  I see the furnace exhaust under the bed and the fresh water filler next to that.  Is the furnace under the bed?  Is the fresh water tank laying front-to-back, behind the storage area's back wall?

I did not realize Phoenix moved the fresh water tank and furnace from my days.  My furnace is under the fridge and my water tank is laying left to right over the rear bumper (not ideal for weight distribution when filled up).  I suppose the furnace got relocated when the fridge was included in the slideout.
1803  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Batteries on: February 17, 2012, 07:43:16 pm
Our 2007 model with Tripp-Lite inverter has a current draw as well with everything turned off.  Interesting comment about the detectors.  I never thought of that.  Though I store the motor home inside a garage with electricity, I do not plug into 120V.  I disconnect the RV batteries, but not the chassis battery.  Once every couple months I put all batteries on a smart charger, 4 amp setting.

I learned something with my original Phoenix supplied batteries.  After the second season, I was getting boil-over and wondered why.  I removed the two batteries and measured their voltage independantly which was just about the same.  I filled them to the proper level with distilled water, and then while on my work bench I wired them together and charged them with a smart charger.  Guess what happened?  They still boiled over.  I was perplexed.  That should not happen with a smart charger.  I then separated them and charged them individually.  One battery accepted the charge without boiling over, and it reached it's proper voltage.  When I did the same to the other battery, it boiled over.  I measured the voltage which was just about right, not quite as much, maybe 11.9V volts.  The next day, just sitting on my work bench the voltage dropped dramatically to around 10V.

The moral to the story.....
If you experience battery boil-over, separate the two batteries and test them independantly.  Apparently one weak battery will fool the charger into pumping a charge until the cows come home, boiling over both batteries in the process.  I replaced them with two new (bigger) batteries from Walmart.  So far so good.  No boil-over yet.
1804  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Towing Dinghys on: February 17, 2012, 09:46:39 am
Interesting about the weight of a 1st generation Liberty.  I got that 3800 pound figure when shopping for a 4x4 three years ago.

I was going to backup my figures so I did new research.  According to Jeep Horizons HERE

With the most common gasoline engine, 3.7L-V6
- manual 6spd 2wd = 3846
- manual 6spd 4wd = 4044
- auto 4spd 4wd = 4115
- auto 5spd 4wd = 4296  (We own this one)

So, you are correct fellows.  I was 500 pounds off my numbers.  Boy my Liberty is awfully heavy.   Cry   It weighs twice that of my little MR2.

Thanks for the correction.  I've been saying 3800 pounds all along....sheesh.
1805  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Towing Dinghys on: February 16, 2012, 11:17:05 pm
Ditto from me on everyone's replies.  Like was shared higher, we got the Liberty 4x4 to be more adventurous.  But that is not everyone's mission.  Our Liberty does weigh 3800 pounds, so it is not as light as many other choices.

We used to tow a 2100 pound Toyota MR2 Spyder without secondary braking, and I considered that "Just Getting By".  Anything heavier and I think you will want secondary braking.

As heavy as our Liberty is, with the seconday braking system we have, it actually helps slow down the motor home.  So if you later consider something heavier, the right braking kit can eliminate any concern of stopping quickly.
1806  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 16, 2012, 12:57:27 pm
If I was Stuart I would be sending you hate mail for posting things like this on their web site. What goes on between Phoenix and a buyer should be between them and not you. If the buyer wants to have things changed, it should be up to them, not you. What a buyer pays for a unit is between them and Phoenix, not you.  I know you are only trying to help, but it is not your business so you should stay out of it.  It is OK to point out the availability of a unit but you should stop there. This is just my thinking and has nothing to do with Phoenix USA. Tom
I do get into trouble by sharing my thoughts and ideas, speaking so freely all the time.  That is why I would make a terrible politician.  Your point is well noted.  I will try to be better in the future.

I was going to share this with them off-line, but they have their email hidden, so I shared it here.  Still not a good excuse.  I will try harder to be a good boy.
1807  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 16, 2012, 09:54:54 am
Paul/Marlyn, Did you know the factory has a used model 2100 for sale right now on ebay? The main differences between that on and a new one are the follow.

- Single battery without inverter
  New one has 2 batteries and whole house inverter
- Old heavy and small screen CRT TV
- Rear outside wall has corner seam work and no rear storage compartment, and spare tire is not integrated
- Conventional screen door
- Looks to be rear heavy, maybe needing helper springs to level it out
- Not a flush mounted stove and sink with covers.

Their price of $30,000 is negotiable.  If money was tight, having to consider a used one, I would not pay his asking price.  But I would discuss it.  One thing for sure is that I would require they do something to level it out, helper springs or air bags, or something.  And have them include in the deal some type of awning, and replace the TV and associated cabinetry with the 26" widescreen and the current cabinets around it.  They have been known to do requests on used models.

Here it is on ebay right now:
1808  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 15, 2012, 05:42:50 pm
Would like to have had swivel drivers chair, however my under 5' bride requiers the 6 way.
I am a lot taller than my wife (as seen in my signature picture) so our leg lengths are quite different.  This means the driver seat goes to extreme positions to accomodate.  The 6-way power seat meets the need nicely.  I also appreciate how I can shift my weight while driving for extended periods, using the tilt and height adjustment.  So for us, the 6-way power seat is essential.

About the outside shower, admittedly we too don't use it a lot, but when we do, it really is nice.  Sometimes after a morning hike, a quick hair shampoo or foot wash is welcoming, especially in hot climates.  We could surely live without an outside shower, but would likely miss it because we have one today.
1809  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 15, 2012, 03:38:13 pm
Yes Barry-Sue.  Good that you emphasised the 2008-2012 E350 suspension was improved over the 2007 E350.  I would not jump into any kind of action with the suspension until after you have driven a few hundred miles in each direction for a weekend get-away.  Experience how your rig handles under various conditions.

The only "Absolute" I strongly advise to do after the first 1000 miles, but not before the 2000 mile mark, is getting a front wheel alignment.  Have it loaded just as you would when pulling away from your house, when leaving for a trip.  Fill the gas tank, fill up the fresh water tank, have non-perishable drinks in the fridge like bottled water, pots & pans and all other stuff in-place, and be sure the waste tanks are empty.  You want the rig's load distributed as it would be when on the open road because the load and how it is distributed affects the wheel alignment.  If you want improved accuracy on load simulation, stack weights just behind the driver and passenger seats to simulate two people sitting in them.   I sort-of did that with a weight set I had.  I did not have enough weight but placed what I had available just behind those two seats.
1810  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 15, 2012, 01:06:49 pm
What are the dimensions of the cabinets next to the TV. We're interested in carrying a small printer and wanted to know if the one we're looking at will fit there.
They are odd shaped cabinets.  The back wall is not parallel to the front, and curves inward.  I also suspect the interior space varies slightly from one rig to another.  I advise not to buy anything until after your rig is in your possesion.  Drive your PC to the store and ask the store clerk if you can take the display printer to your rig to see if it fits right.  They are usually fine with that when leaving your driver's license at the customer service counter.
1811  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 15, 2012, 12:57:34 pm
We too have the Thermal Pane Windows.  They are a noticable contribution in comfort for both temperature and reducing outside noises.

About the roof rack and ladder, I asked they give them to me in parts, not mounted to the PC.  5 years later and I am still very happy with that decision.  The ladder and rack are stored at home just in case I ever change my mind.  I project I may sell them to another PC owner one day, after their old ladder weathered badly and they can't stand looking at it any longer.  The rack and ladder add numerous screw holes in the roof and rear wall with caulk to seal them....let's just say, it ain't pretty.  But other PC owners love them.  Barry-Sue and us are in the minority.

One thing I regret getting with ours, is the roof-top Winegard antenna.  It worked fine for the first year.  But after analog signaling was terminated throughout the country, we have never been successful in utilizing it.  Now it just sits up top with lots of caulk and holes in our B+ areo cap.  Cry

I too installed our own TV's front and back, simply to save money and get bigger TV's as well.  Back in 2007 the front TV from PC-USA was 20", I installed a 26".  Our bedroom TV is a 19" widescreen with integrated DVD player.  The savings was huge and the TVs were better.  But I admit that it took much research to get a TV that fit and worked right, and the front installation was a challenge for me.  It's not a project for everyone.
1812  Main Forum / General Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself! on: February 15, 2012, 11:50:40 am
We have an older 2007 2350 model.  Like Barry-Sue says, the handling of the 2350 is typically poor right from the factory.  I would imagine the 2100 would have similar handling concerns.  There are a couple factors as to why.

1) - The distance between front and rear wheels called the wheel base is too little when considering the large amount of house over-hanging behind the rear wheels.
2) - The 2100 and 2350 are built on the lighter duty E350.  The 2551 and larger PCs are built on the E450 that has a heavier duty suspension.

I would not let these comments discourage you from considering a 2100 or 2350.  Just be aware of this.  If you find the handling acceptable, then there is nothing more to do.  If it handles too poorly for comfort, then consider investing in a few suspension upgrades.

I hate to share what we had done because it scares people.  We went all-out doing everything that came recommended by our local motor home suspension shop.  Since we had the work done, our 2350 handles nice and tight, firmly planted on the road like an SUV, instead of a drunken sailer.  And the ride is not harsh either.  We love it for both comfort and safety.  My thinking is that if it prevents just one accident, it paid for itself at least 100 fold in saving the PC, the tow vehicle, us the occupants, and anyone else around us who might be involved.

Here are the details on what we had the shop do for us.

1) - Added a heavy duty rear sway bar.
       E350s made prior to 2008 did not come with any kind of rear sway bar.
2) - Replaced the front sway bar with a heavy duty bar.
      The Ford stock bar is the same one used in the light duty E150
3) - Replaced the 4 Ford shocks with Koni-RV adjustable shocks, set to the stiffest of the 3 settings
      Today I recommend Koni-FSDs, offered only through Henderson Line-Up.
      The FSD shocks are designed for class-A and Super-C motor homes.
      I understand Henderson replaces the 3/4" mounting bushing in each shock with a 5/8" to fit an E350/E450
      The stock Ford shocks are the same used on an E250 van.
4) - Replaced the front steering stabilizer with a heavy duty one
      The stock Ford one is the same used on an E150 van
5) - Added a rear Trac bar.
      This eliminates horizonal side-to-side motion of the rear end, referred to as tail wagging
      Especially benefitial when towing.
6) - A front wheel alignment
      The camber was so far out of whack that the shop used special off-set bushings to correct it
      Such bushing kits are available as this is a very common problem with many brand motor homes.

We had our local shop order and install everything which was not the cheapest way of handling this.  It cost us $3900 but worth every penny. Since the work was done in late mid 2007, we can take on hair-pin turns on scenic byways with the greatest of confidence keeping all 6 tires firmly planted on the road for good control and braking while in the turns.  The rig hardly leans in the turns.  Also on the open road when semi-trucks pass and when gusting cross winds are present, driving is still a casual one hand-on-the-wheel experience.  Driver fatique is greatly reduced which is another comfort and safety factor.
1813  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Re: Bike Rack on: February 14, 2012, 02:22:52 pm
Now you have convinced me that I should consider the dual hitch reciever.   ThumbsUp
1814  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Re: Replacing carpet with vinyl on: February 14, 2012, 11:13:05 am
Lots & lots of holes left from the staples....Got it lmichael.  Thanks!
1815  Main Forum / Tips and Tricks / Re: Replacing carpet with vinyl on: February 13, 2012, 10:32:25 pm
I had always understood the vinyl flooring covers the entire plywood floor to protect it from various types of water damage.  I would never remove any section of it for that very reason.  I would install any replacement flooring over it.  Just make sure there are no issues with slideouts and the change in the floor height.  If removing the carpet to expose and use the vinyl floor, you may need to use an adhesive remover.  There might also be staple holes as previously mentioned in the vinyl from when they mounted the carpet.  So you might be disappointed in it's condition.  It seems like you all know this already, but I am just making sure.

If our carpet ever needed replacing and/or our vinyl flooring started looking worn out many years from now, I would likely consider a laminate floor over the top of the vinyl.
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