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Author Topic: Selling your 2350 with dinette? Want to buy used.  (Read 9760 times)
ragoodsp
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Helpful Rating: 37
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PurchDate: May 5, 2012
Model: 3100
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« Reply #150 on: April 03, 2012, 08:02:59 pm »

Sherman:

You sure appear to have a handle on all the answers now.  i would just bite the bullet and place a deposit on a PC first thing in the morning!  I might suggest that you not take the Sprinter to Mel's shop for service for there is just something bothersome about a service manager who things he knows more than the engineers, especially German enginners.  Oh yes, did anyone tell you about the urea tank on the new Sprinters that need service at every oil change?  best of luck.
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sajohnson
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« Reply #151 on: April 03, 2012, 10:57:42 pm »

If I had all of the answers I'd be a very rich man indeed!

As it is, I seem to have all the information I need about idling the V-6 in the Sprinter chassis.  M-B in Germany says up to one hour at the stock idle speed is ok, and that should be enough for my needs.  If not, I know it definitely is possible to get an authorized Sprinter dealer to install the M-B high idle option.

I do find it interesting when there is conflicting information about any subject though.  There may be one or more reasons for that:

1) There are plenty of people who think they know better than engineers and damage or destroy equipment as a result.
2) There are times when 'real-world' experience is truly different from what the engineers had counted on.
3) Information doesn't always get disseminated well within an organization.
4) Sometimes well-intentioned employees will give out false or inaccurate information without realizing it.
5) Mfrs want to please the customer and sell their products, but they also have liability and warranty concerns that may influence their answers to questions.
6) If information is not in writing, and must be passed on verbally, it can quickly get corrupted.

As I said, I have enough info for my needs.  Unless I have a strong reason to believe otherwise, I am going to go by what Neal S. @ M-B USA said -- one hour max. at normal/stock idle speed.  Who knows, if enough people question this, M-B engineering may come out with a revised, written statement -- something that will be added to the Sprinter owners manual.  I'm very surprised that there is currently nothing in writing about idle time, both with and w/o the high idle option.

In Mel's defense, he did not come across like a know-it-all.  At no point in our conversation did he say or even hint that he knew more than the M-B engineers -- he simply relayed his real-world experience as a shop foreman in a large Sprinter repair facility.  What he _did_ say was that he was curious as to why M-B would limit the idle times, since in his experience it isn't an issue.  He intends to check into it further at M-B USA headquarters when he is there in the near future because he realizes there may be concerns he is not aware of.

Mel and I actually spoke about the DEF/urea (which I was aware of).  It came up in our conversation because we were talking about how the various Sprinter engines (I-5, V-6, V-6 w/DEF) might react differently to idling and how that might explain some of the conflicting stories and info.  The DEF is a big improvement in that it allows the Sprinter V-6 to put out significantly more torque and hp while producing fewer emissions.  M-B sized the DEF tank so that it only needs to be filled every 10,000 miles, with every oil change.  From what I've read, filling the DEF tank costs about $8.

Does Ford publish any information about idling the V-10?

Does Ford offer a high idle option?

Any idea how long the V-10 can be idled, both at stock idle rpm and high idle (if available)?

It may be able to be idled longer since gasoline engines tend to maintain their operating temp better.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2012, 11:01:09 pm by sajohnson » Logged

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ragoodsp
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Helpful Rating: 37
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Model: 3100
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« Reply #152 on: April 04, 2012, 09:50:18 am »

I truly think the idle issue has run out of fuel at this time!!  My last point to make is that the 3.0L has a very complicated intake system that all evolves around a very small swirl valve that  entails a little electric motor and valve system to keep everything moving in the intake area.  Over time it gets gummed to the point the valve does not work any longer and it sets off all the check engine, throttle body lights.  excess idling and oil that blows by (diesels all blow oil by) are the two causes of the failure.  My nephews 08 3.0L with 42,000 miles just had to have the valve replaced to the tune of $2962.00, his extended drive trian warranty did not cover the cost.  The dealer stated that many Sprinter based 3.0L have this issue, one had two before 100,000 miles.  The 3.0L is one tough engine that likes to be driven and driven hard on the highway everyday that is when you will see the 250,000 miles with little trouble.   Again, the engine does not like to be idled and it can get very costly to do so.  Thanks.
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sajohnson
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« Reply #153 on: April 05, 2012, 04:06:07 am »

But wait -- there's more!!

Something that hasn't been mentioned is the Espar heater.  It has the ability to keep the engine at proper operating temperature, which goes a long way toward eliminating many of the problems associated with idling the 3.0L diesel engine, and can be used as an aux coach heat source.

So unless a higher than stock idle speed is needed for greater output from the alternator, there is no reason to bump the idle speed up when using an Espar.

Looks like the Sprinter engine may be a very good source of back up power after all.
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sajohnson
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« Reply #154 on: April 07, 2012, 01:02:16 am »

To get back to the original topic of this thread -- we're still looking for a 2350 but instead of the larger dinette and no slide (like Ron's) we've decided that the more common sofa/bed in a slide will work best for us.

I'm looking for ideas as to where to look for late model used PC 2350s.

Of course I looked at PC's website first and continue to check it.  I've also tried:

www.rvt.com
www.oodle.com
www.pplmotorhomes.com
www.usedrvsforsale.com

One feature I find useful is being able to sign up for notifications if what you're looking for is listed.  If you're aware of any site with that feature it's a big plus.

Any suggestions appreciated.

Thanks!
 
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ron.dittmer
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« Reply #155 on: April 07, 2012, 09:33:16 am »

Ebay has them pop up on occasion, and ebay has an auto-notifier too.
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Ron Dittmer (wife Irene) 2007 Model 2350 Without A Slideout
Our Rig Is Available For Viewing Any Time Of Year In Dundee, IL
Stored At Home In Our Heated Garage (Well-Lit & Warm Comfort In Winter)
sajohnson
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Helpful Rating: 0
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« Reply #156 on: April 07, 2012, 05:35:28 pm »

Ebay has them pop up on occasion, and ebay has an auto-notifier too.

Thanks Ron, great suggestion!

I'm not in the habit of using eBay (although I have in the past) so I hadn't thought to try there.

I've already set up a search with email notification.
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I'm on an epic quest for a class B+/C RV that is as close to perfect as possible!
ron.dittmer
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Helpful Rating: 174
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« Reply #157 on: April 07, 2012, 07:44:03 pm »

The Ebay bidding or Buy-It-Now process is not always the means.  Often the auction ends and there is no buyer, whether nobody bid, or a reserve was not met.  Afterwards, you can contact the seller and discuss it between just the two of you as you would on RVtrader, craigslist, etc.
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Ron Dittmer (wife Irene) 2007 Model 2350 Without A Slideout
Our Rig Is Available For Viewing Any Time Of Year In Dundee, IL
Stored At Home In Our Heated Garage (Well-Lit & Warm Comfort In Winter)
sajohnson
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Helpful Rating: 0
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« Reply #158 on: April 07, 2012, 10:47:40 pm »

The Ebay bidding or Buy-It-Now process is not always the means.  Often the auction ends and there is no buyer, whether nobody bid, or a reserve was not met.  Afterwards, you can contact the seller and discuss it between just the two of you as you would on RVtrader, craigslist, etc.

I remember you mentioning that before, earlier in this thread when you found that low-priced RV on eBay.

Of course, if I find a 2350 that's what we're looking for I'd want to bid, or maybe even take the 'buy it now' price if it is reasonable.  I gather you're saying that if I bid but do not win the auction I should check with the seller to see if the 'winner' backed out, or the reserve wasn't met, and try to make a private deal -- is that right?   
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