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Messages - Grandpa17

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General Discussion / Re: 2019 E 450 dome lights
« on: January 17, 2020, 08:01:35 am »
Here is the answer to your dome light question.  There is a switch at the dome lights that will turn them off so when you open the door they will not turn on.  If you leave that switch in the on position and so when the door opens they come on then you can do this.  Let the courtesy light timer wind down so the lights turn off while you are sitting in the drivers seat, then reach down with your left hand and rotate the dash dimmer switch all the way up until you feel it click and look at your dome lights, they are on.  The confusion is because the on off switch between the dome lights.

The switch below the radio is for the starting battery or coach batteries, so when your parked you can listen to the radio off of your house batteries. This was spec'd by the original owner of my PC and then adopted for follow on coaches I believe, so late in 2017 I believe it became standard... 

Hope that helps and happy travels!

Awesome!  Hadnít thought of that.  Makes sense now. Agree, this is what makes the forum so great!

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed improvement
« on: January 12, 2020, 01:45:54 pm »

I agree with everything you said too.  We came off a coach with on-demand water and it was great.  For any coach where that is a viable option I would always choose an on-demand system.  I just wouldn't want anyone considering a floor plan that requires a combi to rule that floor plan out on that basis only.  Given what it's designed for it performs very good.

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed improvement
« on: January 12, 2020, 10:56:50 am »

After loving the Truma AquaGo On-Demand RV Water Heater, we see the Combi as a step backward, a step we do not wish to take.

I agree that compared to a Truma AquaGo On-Demand RV Water Heater, it would seem a step back.  The primary reason for the Truma Combi is compactness.  The only reason to use it is to save space.  It is used primarily in Van conversions where space is extremely limited.  PC told me that they didn't have the space in the 2351D to install a separate furnace and water heater so they used the Combi.  After having used it for 3 weeks continually now, I am overall happy with it.  I would certainly prefer an on-demand water heater, but I think it was a good decision on the part of PC to save the space on this floor plan.  Also I am of the school of leaving the grey tank valve closed until practically full.   With such small holding tanks on the 2351D if we took long showers I'd be dumping the grey tank every day.  Now that we've figured out how to use it properly the small water tank isn't much of an issue.  The main thing is to have a shutoff valve on the shower head.

General Discussion / Re: 2019 E 450 dome lights
« on: January 12, 2020, 10:38:46 am »
Okay, I finally had a chance to do some experimenting.  Here's what I found with the ignition having been off at least long enough for the courtesy parking lights to go out:

I can turn the dome lights on before the ignition key is inserted.
If I insert the ignition key, but don't turn it, they stay lit
As soon as I turn the ignition key they go out
If I return the ignition key to the locked, or off position, the lights remain off
As soon as I remove the ignition key they turn on
If I simply re-insert the ignition key - even without turning it, the lights go out
If I remove the key again, they turn on

If I open the driver door, get out and wait a while for the parking lights to go out and get back in they act as described above

Very confusing why they are wired like this.  Possibly it's a new safety requirement that they can't work while driving?

I also found that the 3 position switch on the dash only controls the right 12v socket as well as power to the in-dash radio.  The left 12v socket remains on all the time, even with the ignition key removed.

General Discussion / Re: 2019 E 450 dome lights
« on: January 12, 2020, 09:30:37 am »
For anyone with a newer E 450 or 350, is there a trick to turning on the dome lights?  Neither of ours work no matter the ignition key position.  Canít find anything in the Ford owners manual so Iím not sure if these lights are Ford OEM or PC.

Thanks in advance.
Do the 12v outlets on the dash work? Could be the fuse?

Yes, the 12v outlets work

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed improvement
« on: January 11, 2020, 06:29:33 pm »
After owning a unit with a Truma AquaGo on-demand heater, we assumed anything named Truma would be Ďon-demandí. After speaking with a Truma customer service rep, here is what my husband learned: it is a tank-type water heater with a very small 2.75 gallon tank. The rep said that for a shower we need to put it on Ďboostí for 1/2hr. prior to taking the shower. But we could only use the Ďboostí setting twice in 1 hour.
They said Ďboostí setting gives about 6 gallons of hot water.

However, the increased capacity is only due to the fact that youíll use a greater mix of cold water during your shower. You still only have a 2.75 gallon tank!

An unknown is the flow rate of a PC shower head. If you assume 1.5 GPM, you are still only going to have 4 minutes of hot water available.

By the way, my husband knows a little about water usage - he owns a plumbing, heating, cooling business. After loving the Truma AquaGo On-Demand RV Water Heater, we see the Combi as a step backward, a step we do not wish to take.

If this info only raises more questions, my hubby would gladly attempt to answer them. Guess I answered my own question, and maybe shed some light on the situation for you. 😉

Everything you have stated is exactly right.    Having used it for about three weeks now and for quite a few showers I can say that it's not all that bad.  We discovered by trial and error exactly what you stated.  Put it on boost and wait 20-30 minutes then get in.  If you wait too long it goes off of boost and the water starts cooling down.   You won't take long hot showers with it, but after getting used to it we found that we could take back to back showers if we turned the flow off at the shower head while washing.  On the air side it does a fantastic job of heating the coach.   I kept it set at 68 degrees and we were very comfortable.   With the electric option it is extremely efficient on gas.  I filled the propane tank before leaving and after 3 weeks of showers and heating in mid 20's-40 degree evenings and a fair amount of driving with the fridge on gas it is still registering full.  I even went out and checked the gauge on the tank to make sure I wasn't getting a false reading.

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed improvement
« on: January 07, 2020, 09:42:27 pm »
Hi, Grampa 17 -

My first time posting/asking questions so weíll see how it goes...

Great post on your part as far as photos and explanation! In our situation itís exactly what we need to know! My husband and I are seriously considering the 2351D. As a matter of fact, tomorrow may by our ĎDí day, so to speak.😉

You mentioned that in your mod you were able to keep the sheet on the mattress when folding it up, as in photo #2. Am I correct in assuming that leaving the sheet on when folding it (as in photo#1) to bring the slide in is not possible? In other words, would all bedding have to come off to bring the slide in on travel days?

When we travel we move quite often so we were hoping to find a 25í rig with a bed we didnít have to make up every night and still have decent living space. From your experience, how do you feel this unit fits into that scenario overall?

Something else you said - you fold up the bed during the day ďto give more space in the bedroom.Ē Is that because, if the bed is down/flat, the bathroom or back wall cabinets are difficult to access?

Assuming (correct me if Iím wrong) you and your wife both use the shower, may I get an opinion from each of you on the bathroom as far as shower size, as well as general roominess using the toilet and lavatory. My husband is 6í 3Ē, 190#, and I am 5í 7Ē, 120#. Iím sure Iíd do okay in the shower, but concerned for hubby. The bathroom, overall, appears to be a little cramped...?

We rarely eat out when on the road, so a user-friendly galley is a must for us. Your thoughts welcome on that subject also.

Any, and all, observations, likes, dislikes you and your wife have on the 2351D would be appreciated.
Thanks for your help!


Iíll try to answer all of your questions.

Re: sheets Iíve posted so many photos Iím not sure exactly which two you are ferreting to, but assuming they are the last two, yes with the factory stock mattress you can leave the sheets on and fold the bottom half over.  You can even leave a light blanket on and fold it over.  With my mod you can leave the sheet on but we pull the light blanket off, fold it and toss the blanket and pillow on top of the folded mattress before flipping the wooden frame over.

Our travel scenario is the same as yours.  It is unusual for us to stay at one location more than a couple days and like you we wanted as compact of a unit as possible.  I can say that we are are very happy with the this floor plan.   Iím not as tall as your husband, but we still wanted at least a queen bed.  With either the stock mattress or my mod it takes maybe 2-3 minutes to setup or tear down the bed.  As you probably know there were several things I didnít like about the stock mattress, one of which is that the bottom 8 inches isnít supported.  It makes getting into bed, or sitting on the edge very annoying.  Plus, the height issue was giving us really bad backaches....

Re: folding it during the day... it isnít entirely necessary, but with the bed down it limits how far the bathroom door can open.  For people with some thickness to them, like myself, itís a bit of a tight squeeze.  And as you mention itís more difficult to access the back cabinets.  My wife prefers the bed down so she can lay down during the day, so oftentimes we do leave the bed down all the time.

Re: the galley, everything 2 frazzled stated applies.. Weíre like you and rarely eat out.  We find the galley adequate - but we just make simple meals.  The microwave, stove and fridge are very nice.

Re the bathroom:  your husband will be fine in the shower girth wise. :-). Iím shorter and weigh about the same and I find it very usable.  His height will be the biggest issue.  If you order one be sure and get the extended height shower dome - which we have.   The bathroom is one of my wifeís main concerns in a motor home and we both find it reasonably comfortable.  Again your husbands height will be the main concern.  There is a decent amount of space between the stool and the wall, but your husband might find it a bit confining.

As you may have read this is our eighth motor home, I spent many months deciding on this unit because I had very specific things I wanted.  Like you I wanted a compact unit no more than 25 ft.  I wanted a heavy-duty chassis and top-notch quality.  Iíve told my wife many times that I am extremely pleased with the decision to get this particular unit.   Itís very solid on the road, drives very nice and Iíve been extremely happy with the quality.  Having said all of that, the PC units have the lowest ceiling height of all of the units I considered.  With your husbandís height, if you havenít already I recommend you visit any PC model you can find in person to see how he feels about the ceiling height.

If you buy a PC I highly recommend the Liquid Springs.  They are an expensive option but they make a substantial difference in the ride.  I also really appreciate the leveling jacks.  We can pull in and be ready to relax in less than 10 minutes.

I hope this helps

Best regards.

General Discussion / 2019 E 450 dome lights
« on: January 07, 2020, 08:29:05 pm »
For anyone with a newer E 450 or 350, is there a trick to turning on the dome lights?  Neither of ours work no matter the ignition key position.  Canít find anything in the Ford owners manual so Iím not sure if these lights are Ford OEM or PC.

Thanks in advance.

General Discussion / Re: Truma Combi Water heater/Furnace
« on: January 03, 2020, 11:28:13 pm »
Yea, information on how to best use the unit is sketchy.  What Iíve found is to set it on boost and wait about a half hour and take your shower right away.  All the manual says is that on boost it will do ďtwo cyclesĒ but gives no explanation of what a ďcycleĒ is.  After the two cycles (canít tell exactly when they are finished) it reverts back to whatever it was set on before setting it to boost.  So if you go from off to boost, it will return to off.  If you wait too long, the water starts cooling off and you wonít have near enough hot water for a shower.  Now that I have it at least partially figured out itís been working well with enough hot water for a good shower.  I do restrict the flow also.  My preference for sure would be an on/demand heater but I was told there wasnít room to fit a furnace and water heater into the 2351D floor plan. 

General Discussion / Re: How many Phoenix Cruisers were produced in 2019?
« on: January 03, 2020, 11:13:52 pm »
When we picked our unit up in October I asked Bob White how many they produce and he said currently they were producing 2 1/2 units per week.   I have no idea if that was due to a surge, or typical.  They were advertising for help also.

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed improvement
« on: January 03, 2020, 09:08:35 pm »
That appears to be a palatable solution  2o2.

Hope your backs feel much better now. Enjoy !

Thanks.   It is very comfortable now and has completely eliminated our back aches.

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed improvement
« on: January 03, 2020, 09:04:53 pm »
thanks for the great pics and info. I will definitely keep this in mind. And when we do pick up our new unit I will ask them if they had any complaints or concerns about the bed.

thanks again

Youíre welcome.  You know of at least one, right? 

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed sucks no more!
« on: January 01, 2020, 11:06:40 pm »
And yes, the bedroom TV is mounted on a swing arm and can be pivoted almost 90 deg.  It locks for travel.  There is a DVD player in the adjoining cabinet.  A very nice setup.

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed sucks no more!
« on: January 01, 2020, 07:25:37 pm »

Yes the left black object is the sub-woofer bolted to the floor with L brackets.  It hasnít felt in the way at all.  The second black object is the fuse panel.  Yes, the 2351D uses a Truma Combi Eco Plus unit.  The ďPlusĒ refers to propane plus 2 electric heating elements which can be used in combination with propane.  Using it set to gas plus electric the unit is extremely gas efficient.  Hot water capacity is usable, but limited.

General Discussion / Re: 2351D bed sucks no more!
« on: January 01, 2020, 01:19:42 pm »
Thanks Ron!  You know what they say about necessity... We are extremely pleased with the comfort.  Two nights now without back aches!

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