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Tiny grey tank issue

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2018, 08:56:50 am »
I'm surprised that PC now installs arrays but doesn't move the antenna to the back like mine. The handle would be in the bedroom on the 2552 just behind the left wardrobe.
I agree with you.  Placing the antenna away from the array where you requested, makes lots of sense.
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JackD

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #16 on: April 07, 2018, 10:28:53 am »
At the risk of turning this thread into solar, has anyone had experience with only one 150w panel?          there was only room for one on my 2350.  We'll be heading to Alaska in June.
Thanks,
Jack

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biglegmax

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #17 on: April 07, 2018, 12:26:46 pm »
Jack, I'm no solar expert, we are having an independent company do ours this summer. Usually you try and match the solar panel watts to battery amp capacity, or even more watts. Just don't forget you can always carry a portable solar panel. Alaska in June is a great place to be, thats where we are headed next year, not many dark hours either.
Doug

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keelhauler

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #18 on: April 07, 2018, 01:26:25 pm »
The long days in Alaska in June should make up for it. We went there putting our RV of 4 different ferry boats in SE alaska in 1994. Had no trouble keeping batteries charged.

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Doneworking

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #19 on: April 07, 2018, 03:58:57 pm »
We boondock for several weeks at a time in the Rockies to escape the July and August heat.  We bought our 2350 for many reasons but the 35 gallon black tank was a big selling point.  Look at the specs on other brands for a length of 23-25 foot coach and mostly you will find smaller tanks.   The ability to easily switch and use the black for additional gray can come in useful.  

I designed and installed 200 watts of solar on our rig.   It is a simple system with no bells and whistles, just a couple of 100 watt Renogy panels from Amazon on the roof, a bit of solar cable and a small controller.  After one summer of using this and finding it satisfactory but loving to park mostly in shady areas, I bought an additional 100 watt flexible panel and hook it up with 50 feet of outdoor landscaping cable which simply plugs into a weatherproof receptacle wired to the system and located at the rear of PC.   I take that panel and move it around two or three times during the day to accommodate sun and shade location.   With this we are usually good for two weeks "off grid".    I don't find moving the panel during the day a hassle and kind of enjoy watching the voltage meter I installed jump up  (cheer).

Paul
« Last Edit: April 07, 2018, 04:00:37 pm by Doneworking »

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Cropduster

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #20 on: April 07, 2018, 06:19:24 pm »
Quote
Just don't forget you can always carry a portable solar panel. Alaska in June is a great place to be, thats where we are headed next year, not many dark hours either.

We utilize a folding solar panel named "50W Complete Kit Folding Portable Solar Panel Off Grid 12V Camping Home Caravan".  Which we have found has enough capacity to keep our single 12v RV battery charged during a week of boondocking.  Granted, solar panel's 3 amp output is not going to do the trick if you're running heavy use through an inverter.   Still, there is something to be said for being out 10 days and not needing to start the generator in order to bring the up the battery's charge.  One reason for selecting this solar panel was due to their size.  Which takes up minimal space, even in our 2100.

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2018, 09:30:26 am »
Some years back I seriously considered going solar.  Our 2007 2350 roof can accommodate one panel easily, two panels if I change our crank-up Winegard antenna to a current-day fixed antenna.  What shut me down about the idea was that we always seek shaded campsites when shade is available, rendering solar technology ineffective when needed most.  I would consider the remote setup that Cropduster uses, but really wanted a hands-off relationship with solar given our on-the-move style of RVing.  Setting up a solar array at the camp site seems ideal if staying stationary for extended periods.

Who knows, maybe I will wake up one day and decide to go solar, maybe when the industry perfects solar technology with thin roll-out, cut-to-fit, stick-down array method, covering our entire white roof with a single sheet.  That would be interesting if it pumped out lots of watts at an affordable price.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2018, 07:15:41 pm by ron.dittmer »
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Cropduster

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #22 on: April 08, 2018, 11:32:05 am »
Quote
What shut me down about it was that we always seek shaded campsites when shade is available, rendering solar technology useless
.
Ron, good point.  Portable solar means we can position the panels where they will catch the most sunlight.  However, I have noticed that the panels will generate electricity even during cloudy conditions.  On a particularly cloudy day I measured an output of 25% of the max.  Which I suppose is respectable.  If the solar panel manufacturers can create panels which utilize perovskite as well as silicon, it will capture more of the light spectrum and significantly increase the panel's output.  I am hoping those will eventually reach the market.

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2 Frazzled

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2018, 05:07:18 am »
Ron, they have solar panels that stick down. I was talking to Kermit at one of the rallies a few years back and he mentioned they had an order to put them on a rig. I told him I hadn't kept up with the industry for many years but last I heard, they got so hot they were setting roofs on fire. He made a phone call and I never heard anything else about it.

It's been a while so it may be worth a look to see if solar people figured a way to resolve that issue. Kids at the solar decathlon one year decided to go for the silver lining and installed stick down solar panels on metal roofing with their water pipes underneath so the intense heat from the solar panels provided their hot water.

Side note on solar: as mentioned a few places on the forum, shade (or dirt or leaves) on one tiny piece of one panel will drop the entire array to match the cell with the lowest gain. UNLESS you have the panels wired parallel instead of in series. Then blocking one cell only affects that one panel. Think of old Christmas lights; in series, one bulb goes out, breaks the circuit, no lights work... but parallel wiring skips that bad bulb and the current continues to flow to all the rest of the bulbs. There are a lot more considerations that I can't speak intelligently on... Yet. Since John finally agreed to solar, I need to learn.
John, Holly, and sometimes Chloe.
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Zorba

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2018, 10:50:18 am »
While I find it odd that the black water tank is so much larger than the grey and I would have done it "opposite", the fix is rather simple. Simply TEE into the grey water drain line, AND a black water vent pipe a foot or so above floor level, put a cheap 12v water pump in-between, and Bob's your uncle. That allows you to pump the entire contents of the grey into the black, not just a "50% draindown" as using the dump valves will give you.
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keelhauler

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2018, 11:58:29 am »
Zorba said
Quote
the fix is rather simple. Simply TEE into the grey water drain line, AND a black water vent pipe a foot or so above floor level, put a cheap 12v water pump in-between, and Bob's your uncle. That allows you to pump the entire contents of the grey into the black, not just a "50% drain down" as using the dump valves will give you.

That gave me a thought, here is a no cost no mod option.
We already have a good pump the macerator. Just hook up a 25' 3/4" water hose to macerator outlet and run the hose to your roof, take off the blackwater vent cap, insert the hose and pump what you want into your blackwater tank. I'll try it out the next time I'm getting too full.

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donc13

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #26 on: April 09, 2018, 06:55:12 pm »
The fact is, if you look at the floorplans, you will see that Phoenix uses only 2 sizes of waste tank.  19 and 35.  The 19 is always mounted on the driver side and the 35 is always on the passenger side. So depending on where your toilet and shower are located that's what determines which tank is black and which is grey. The exception is the 3100 where one tank is 50
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JackD

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2018, 04:04:19 pm »
Thanks all for the replies on solar - I think I'll bo OK.  I had rain, rain, back from the factory, and my one panel still charged the batteries, while "dry" camping in wet!!!Jack

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #28 on: April 11, 2018, 11:19:29 am »
The fact is, if you look at the floorplans, you will see that Phoenix uses only 2 sizes of waste tank.  19 and 35.  The 19 is always mounted on the driver side and the 35 is always on the passenger side. So depending on where your toilet and shower are located that's what determines which tank is black and which is grey. The exception is the 3100 where one tank is 50
I am no authority on this, but understand it as follows.

For most PC models in the shorter lengths, the two tanks used in PCs are 23 gallons mounted on the passenger side, and 35 gallons mounted on the driver side, I assume because the deeper outdoor storage compartment is desired on the passenger side and the shallow Sanicon system on the driver side.  In every situation the toilet "absolutely must" be placed near the black tank so poop gets into the tank by gravity, not relying on water because so little water is used.  So, with the two tanks in fairly "fixed" positions under the house, the floor plans are designed around the limited positioning of the toilet.  I also assume the inlet into the black tank is cut out rather than molded in so there is some flexibility with the relationship between toilet and tank.  I would have thought Phoenix would have come up with floor plans placing the toilet over the smaller tank to make it the black one on the passenger side.  But then maybe the floor plans would have become undesirable.  Also, having the black tank closest to the dump is most desirable to avoid a poop blockage in a lengthy drain pipe.

PCs in the longer lengths have more flexibility with tank positions and sizes for obvious reasons, having more room under the rig to work with.

That is my understanding, but I surely could have it all wrong.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2018, 11:36:00 am by ron.dittmer »
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donc13

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Re: Tiny grey tank issue
« Reply #29 on: April 11, 2018, 03:56:44 pm »
Actually, in my 2015 PC2551 the 35gal black tank sits inside the frame on passenger side thus avoiding the slide out storage.

The 23 gal grey water tank sits on the driver's side outside the frame and is narrower and shorter.

My particular unit was one of the units they tested the turbo sanicon on.  My sanicon is an engineering prototype.  In any event... If you look at the floor plans vs where the toilet sits, you will see if the toilet is on the passenger's side, or middle inside the frame, the black tank is 35 Gal,   When the  toilet is on the driver's side.. the black tank is only 23 Gal.
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