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TRX

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hutch42

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TRX
« on: July 14, 2019, 11:11:35 am »
Curious.  Has anyone seen or heard anything about the TRX?  Figured maybe PC is waiting for the all new upgrade 2020 Ford Transit chassis this fall.  Maybe they have put a hold on with the down turn in motorized RV (exception class B) sales the past year.

Hutch

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CalCruiser

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Re: TRX
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2019, 05:17:25 pm »
Curious about Winnebagos'  new 2350 Transit clone (Fuse 23F)

And about why Winnebago only offered an Ecoboost powered Paseo, and why that got the axe.
 
And about the updated Ford e-series with the all-new 7.3 Godzilla V8 and 10 speed transmission.

Any clues Hutch ?
Goin' where the wind goes...

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hutch42

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Re: TRX
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2019, 06:56:48 pm »
Curious about Winnebagos'  new 2350 Transit clone (Fuse 23F)

And about why Winnebago only offered an Ecoboost powered Paseo, and why that got the axe.
 
And about the updated Ford e-series with the all-new 7.3 Godzilla V8 and 10 speed transmission.

Any clues Hutch ?


I can help a little on 2 of the 3 questions.  I have belong to the Fuse owners forum since its inception.  The Fuse has been out of production since early March.  It appears that the primary reason is to reevaluate what they are going to do with the all new 2020 Ford Transit when its available in the late fall.  Theres thought if they do anything that it may not be called a Fuse ....something different perhaps?  The other piece of the puzzle was to help reduce the glut of inventory on dealers lots.  Winnebago is down 19% in class A&C sales the first 3 qtrs of their fiscal year.  A industry wide problem due to 7 strong years of RV growth.  According to the WBGO CEO things are leveling off. 

The story on the 2350 look alike Fuse 23F.  It was introduced only last July  and has not been a big seller.  Partially because of the loss of sales in Class C, and perhaps the undersized "Corner Bed" according to Fuse Forum members.  The 23T and 2551/52 clone 23A have sold very well.  Recently this has helped new sales of the 23F because theres no more 23A's and T's on the market.  4-5 F's have sold in the last few weeks.

The Paseo.  Cant be a whole lot of help.  The rumors on the street point to a larger then normal amount of glitches with equal amount of customer complaints about them. The killer was the beds would only sleep someone less then 5'-10"...a mistake that WBGO has fessed up to.  The gas engine like the Travato could be combined with a second alternator to power the (at the time) future Lithium package.  Cant do that with a diesel engine due to the long hours of idle time.**

Sorry cant be of any help with the new V8....lots of wondering out there though.

**Better splain this one a little better.  Ford and MB say the Turbos and DEF systems dont do well idling for long periods of time due to clogging, pressure, moisture? etc.

PS...I would be in arrears if I did not mention that any glitches were strictly WBGO's or vendor equipment.  The 400+ Fuse Ford Transits chassis have performed flawlessly!
The Fuse owners have been very supportive (unlike MB chassis owners)  Easy handling, great turning radius, lots of pull and power, great mileage, and Ford dealers everywhere.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 07:27:25 pm by hutch42 »

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CalCruiser

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Re: TRX
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2019, 01:21:14 pm »
Interesting that Winnebago completely stopped making Transit bís and cís   (exactly)

A 2100 or 2350 with the new 7.3 Godzilla v8 and 10 speed transmission cruising along at 1200 rpm  might be capable of 14 mpg . Same GVWR and keep the generator too.
Goin' where the wind goes...

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: TRX
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2019, 05:18:52 pm »
A 2100 or 2350 with the new 7.3 Godzilla v8 and 10 speed transmission cruising along at 1200 rpm  might be capable of 14 mpg . Same GVWR and keep the generator too.
Our 2007 2350 with V10 and the Torqueshift trans of the that time period, not towing our Jeep Liberty, cruising at 65mph on a wind-less day got a steady 13 mpg on I-94 all day according to the Scanguage-II.  But those conditions are hard to come by.  I swear we typically deal with a head wind regardless of the direction we travel.....Murphy's Law.

I agree about the GVWR and gas generator.
Ron (& Irene) Dittmer

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hutch42

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Re: TRX
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2019, 08:30:15 pm »
Interesting that Winnebago completely stopped making Transit bís and cís   (exactly)

A 2100 or 2350 with the new 7.3 Godzilla v8 and 10 speed transmission cruising along at 1200 rpm  might be capable of 14 mpg . Same GVWR and keep the generator too.

Not sure whats going to happen with a B Transit for WBGO.  The 2020 B+/C Fuse would have been due out in June/July.  Probably does not make sense to introduce a new model 3 months before the new 2020 Transit chassis rolls out. (verified from inside info)  I think the bean counters have a hand in some of this stuff.  The Transit Fuse only represented about 3% of their total yearly motorized production.

The B class vans with no generator and 600-900 amps of Lithiums, 12VDC AC and induction cooking, charged off solar and engine alternators are getting huge.  Different generation and mind set. :'(  IMPO I think its a little early in development for all this stuff.  There again I guess someone has to start somewhere.


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Doneworking

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Re: TRX
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2019, 09:57:20 am »
Hutch 42, count me in that group in your last paragraph above.  I want stuff I can fix when I am a long way from (so called) civilization.   Take a look at my post about the water pump replacement out in the middle of nowhere.   If it was up to me, I would still be lighting the water heater with a match like on my first motorhome.   I simply observe toooooo many problems with some of the new technology.  If it requires "the dealer" to fix it, I probably won't like it.   I put on my own solar and controller, fed it into a couple of lead acid golf cart sixes and can boondock with plenty of power for  the PC2350 for weeks at a time.  I think my basic problem is a dual background:  engineering and finance.   Complexity and high costs tend to make me gasp (WH)
« Last Edit: July 16, 2019, 09:59:52 am by Doneworking »

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CalCruiser

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Re: TRX
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2019, 05:21:33 pm »
The EPA is ok with idling a 3 liter diesel to charge lithium ion coach batteries, but they won't allow you to rebuild the carburetor on your little 9 hp Onan because it might run too rich.
No doubts Winnebago will offer the $$$ Pure3 Energy Management System  option on future class A  and C models with the 7.3 liter gas v8 too. But I wouldn't expect Phoenix to independently develop something like that.

I second Doneworking' s sentiments (exactly) 
A motorhome  requires the multiple skill sets for maintaining  both a house and a vehicle,  whether or not  you pay an expert  or do it yourself.  The K.I.S.S. principle originated in the Navy, but the proverbial middle of nowhere could be on terra firma too.

Goin' where the wind goes...

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biglegmax

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Re: TRX
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2019, 05:27:56 pm »
KISS is a great concept, I've always been on board with that. But come on guys.... Gasoline, propane, solar, AC, DC, did you ever count the soleniod valves? PC's have evolved into something that is not simple or KISS.

I would much rather have Diesel, DC, solar and a few hand operated ball valves....PERIOD! I hope thats where someone will land eventually, lithium or no.

My .02 is that PC will milk the E chassis for as long as possible. I don't see them tooling up for the new transit, too big a change, they can't compete, and the passion is gone....

Doug

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Ron Dittmer

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Re: TRX
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2019, 06:39:55 pm »
The way I see it, 2006 was that last year of 100% PC simplicity.  2007 (the year we own), Phoenix added a second house battery and whole house inverter, a bit more complicated but I feel worth the KISS violation.  Even that great feature had the drawback of the two house batteries completely exposed to the rear tires.  I had to come up with my own solution for that one SEEN HERE.  Every year thereafter, Phoenix continued their feature-improvement plan which seemed to veer off the KISS principle.  Don't misunderstand me, I think a lot of great improvements were made since we bought our PC.  But everything does have it's trade-offs.  More features makes for a nicer experience.....when everything is working right.  I think it is human nature (and I am human) to watch things improve over the years and evaluate my desire for those features in our PC.   I have implemented a few subsequent year enhancements, but I always weigh the benefit versus complexity, and also their implementation impact to our PC.  I try hard to keep the KISS principle a very high priority.

Irene and I went as far as KISSing away a slide out which was a great personal decision, but is obviously not a popular one.  Twelve years later, I think I have settled down in a fairly good place with our PC.  It is my nature to tinker but I try to do it wisely.  Today I am playing with softer E150 front coil springs on our E350 because our front axle is so light weight.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2019, 07:19:16 pm by Ron Dittmer »
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gandalf42

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Re: TRX
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2019, 11:14:59 am »
Yes I believe in the KISS principle and as such avoided a slide and levelers. I would have avoided a power step but not really feasible.

There are a couple of places where PC lost it on the KISS principle.

One, the motorized opening of the tank valves. A simple set of pull handles would be better and more trustworthy.

The other is the 4 way/ 3 way valves. These are a hassle to use and, I suspect, prone to failure. Why not the one inlet to fill the tank, one inlet for city (pressurized) water and then some method to hook up for winterizing?  (WH)
Mike & Pat Astley,

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hutch42

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Re: TRX
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2019, 11:27:01 am »
Speaking of KISS....you can count on one hand technology changes made on the "Holy Grail" in the past 10 years.  It took them 5 years to get convinced to use LED lighting.

They have recently added 6V AGM's and one solar panel as standard equipment.  Plus you can still option a CB radio.  Just have to wait almost 2 years to get one.


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Doneworking

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Re: TRX
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2019, 11:36:38 am »
gandalf42, I find my 2013 to really work well for us.   A hole on the passenger's side to put fresh water into the tank.  A hookup direct to the plumbing system on the driver's side.  A couple of valves to flush the gray and black tanks.  I like that last one best.  I had one of those awful wands you stuck down into the black tank to try and clean it and they worked but YUCK!   

In economics we speak about the Law of Diminishing Returns.   I suspect we violated that in RV design for many of us many gadgets and CAD designs ago.   I sometimes wonder if the highway engineers really drive and I wonder if many of the RV designers ever have an RV????   

Get ready.  RV sales are really off this year.  Take a look:  https://www.rvia.org/news-insights/rv-shipments-may-2019

That obviously is going to affect new product design and manufacturing. 

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gandalf42

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Re: TRX
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2019, 02:17:59 pm »
gandalf42, I find my 2013 to really work well for us.   A hole on the passenger's side to put fresh water into the tank.  A hookup direct to the plumbing system on the driver's side.  A couple of valves to flush the gray and black tanks.  I like that last one best.  I had one of those awful wands you stuck down into the black tank to try and clean it and they worked but YUCK!   

The flush valves are great to have. I don't understand the gravity feed on the passenger side though as hookups are almost always on the driver's side and they have run lines over to the driver's side to the 4 way/3 way valve.
Mike & Pat Astley,

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CalCruiser

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Re: TRX
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2019, 02:54:01 pm »
Interesting that class b van sales are getting hammered the worst. There's still a glut of unsold Roadtreks and Carados left over from the bankruptcy too. 20% below invoice doesn't even move them. 

But apparently Winnebago Revels are selling for full msrp with a waiting list .
To Barry or Pete or whoever is running the TRX program - maybe consider going back and reading the original TRX thread sometime before committing to a new floorplan  ;)
Goin' where the wind goes...